Lovely ladies how have you been? All is well I suppose, Chie has not told me otherwise. I was called up to write this week because Chie and I have recently had to deal with our child’s interaction with other kids. We are at present trying to work through some of these new challenges. Our most recent interpersonal challenge has come as we try to teach Kiko how to “play” or interact with other kids. I put play in quotes because at 18 months, there is no play in the traditional sense it’s more just let children play by themselves in close proximity to one another. The idea that you can make an 18 month play with another child of similar age becomes obviously silly after one attempt and failure. You can try as hard as you want to try and get toddlers to play together but at this age they still don’t seem to have much of sense beyond “I am the center of the world and everything else in it serves me”. Sadly, selfishness is an inherent quality.
That being said I do still think that it is very important to bring ye ol’ toddlers to places where they can learn to interact with other similar aged kids. It’s is mostly because it gives them the opportunity to interact with someone else who thinks like they do…that the world belongs exclusively to them. It seems to me a good reason to do this is that it gives, you as the parent, an opportunity to teach and discipline your child when after a minute or two start having problems with the other babies in the vicinity.
All parents know what problems arise when two or more babies are in the same place. Toys become sources of contention, parental attention becomes worth more than gold and ownership of land becomes pretext for war. This is certainly not a good thing but it is part of the child’s condition and its good to teach and discipline from an early age. Caught early, you can set your child up to learn the lessons of sharing, others’ feelings, and social interaction from an early age.
I’ll set the scene for you: Jane and Suzy are in a play area in close proximity. Jane has a toy, Suzy has a toy. Suddenly Suzy wants Jane’s toy and grabs it. Moments after the grab, Jane realizes this sin has taken place, screams and launches a perfectly placed right cross on Suzy’s chin. Now the screaming is all encompassing. The parents hear and come running to figure out what went down.
From my perspective, this scene is not uncommon, it is not really all that big of a deal in and of itself. If Jane and Suzy’s parents act in a teaching/disciplining way all is well. I’m a bit of a brute with my daughter so my first reaction is quick grab, pick up and a stern whack on the wrist followed by a reprimand(which admittedly they dot understand but they get your pissed and what they did was not to your liking). My reaction is usually faster and more strict than many, but as long as the other parent is in that kind reaction parameter, I am cool with the other parents reaction. If I am Suzy or Jane’s parent, I plan on disciplining in the above stated way and have an expectation that you will act in some similar fashion.
Here is the problem, and I would like y’all’s thoughts on this; if in the situation described, I disciple/teach my child but the other parent just passively allows the child to act like a selfish violent brat, how should I, the parent, respond? I have been in this situation a few times. Once I let it happen because screaming, as would be my natural tendency, was not socially expedient because we were in a large group and it would have caused a fair bit of discomfort. On another occasion however, I witnessed the event, saw the child’s mother do nothing and let the daddy’s right fist of verbal fury fly.
As said, I don’t expect every parents reaction to be the same as mine, but I do expect the reaction to be somewhere in the ballpark. Ladies, what say you?
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Arellis Pena says
I react the same way in that I sternly tell my twins that hitting, throwing toys at others, etc is not ok and hurts them. I don’t discipline them with a smack on the hand (even though that is what my family think is the best and only way to do it) because I seriously believe that I would be teaching them to hit back as a solution. I do give a warning and if they do it again I take away the toys they were using for a while and that alone makes them very upset, which I think gets the point across as much as it’s going to. My twins are 2 now, but when they were smaller I also experienced a few situations where the parents didn’t do anything, and when the problem continued I let them know (even though they already know) that their baby/toddler is throwing things at the others and when singled out like that the parents are “forced” to do something about it. Even if they act begrudgingly (which is not always the case), i don’t care because they need to attend to their child. Now, when they are home they can do whatever they want, but around other people the point is to, as you say, teach them how to socialize properly.
Andy says
Arellis, Thanks for the comment. I appreciate your way of handling things. Good luck in the battle.
theperfectnose says
Hahaha hilarious. I was laughing when I read the title of the post and it got funnier when I read that you erupted at the evil doer’s parent (s). As a trouble maker I would instruct my (currently hypothetical) kid to punch back only at the kid who’s parents don’t control/ discipline them and ‘use words only’ on other kids. My mum would strongly disagree. However, her pacifism was fairly useless to me in kindergarten as ‘words’ don’t work when there’s a dumb kid sitting on your head, punching you in the back. So I learnt pretty quick to find even bigger, dumber kids to pummel back the little dumb kids that bullied me by sharing treats and ‘helping’ with homework. And since I wasn’t the one punching back, it helped maintain the schoolyard ecosystem at status quo.This strategy worked well into primary school and still works (albeit in a non-physical way) XD
Andy says
Ha! I laughed. I’ll. see if Kiko can restore the daycare center ecosystem to homeostasis.
Vicki says
You’re coming up to the most violent age – 2 to 3 years old – when any group of kids will almost constantly be hitting, pushing and biting each other. Sometimes all at once. They can’t talk very well yet, and the only way they know how to negotiate is physically. My kids used to come home with bites about once a week (and with reports that they had done the same). Thankfully, they do learn and grow out of it.
We never put up with any hitting, and would call it out immediately and separate the kids. They don’t yet fully understand what happened, but they know something went wrong and now they are alone, so after 1 billion repeats, they start to get it. It’s hard to see your kid hiting or being hit, but it’s going to happen and all you can do is keep on reinforcing that it’s wrong and they will eventually get it – in a year or two! Distraction and separation are about the only things that work at that little monster age. As far as diciplining another person’s kid, that’s tricky. The most you can do is point it out, then remove your kid from the situation if the parent doesn’t act.
I love hearing a Dad’s perspective on kid rearing. There is far too little of it out there relative to Moms’ perspectives!
Andy says
Your description was fantastic. I now imagine that the 3 year old room at the daycare center will look much like the roman colosseum. I look forward to yelling in Japanese because I get to use my Japanese scary man voice but sadly it is incomprehensible so I am not sure the parents have any idea about what I am babbling about.
Kathya says
Sadly, 2’s and 3’s are a hard stage. For both, parent and child. You want to mold your baby to be this perfect human being, kind, gentle, lovable but at this age is just too much to ask for (IMO). They cant express their feelings well, their frustrations so therefore they hit or throw a tantrum. We as parents need to teach them to relax, calm down and BREATHE!!!! (hahahaa it is hard, believe me. i have 3 girls -5-3-1 years of age). i used to spank and i just felt so guilty afterward. why? because, i did it out of anger. My child was dealing with anger and she hit as well, and what am i doing??? the same.
Now, i just take the child away, and when old enough after age 2+ (i think) i tell them what they did was wrong and to APOLOGIZE.
As far as the other parents goes… i have learned after 5.5 years of being a mother, raising my child in a foreign country (i come from Bolivia but live in the US for a little over 7 years now) and without my side of the family to help, that all i can do is take care of my own.
Good luck! and sorry it was so long. ^_^
The trend now in the USA is to let the children “solve” the problem or ignore that your child is being a bully. I HATE this! but my solution is to sadly, stop playdates with said family and protect my own.
Now, this is what i see after 5.5 years of parenting and friends with kids that arent discipline… Their kids are honestly, a mess. They don’t have respect for their own parents, or other adults and still throw huge tantrums after age 6 or even 7, as if they were 2 or 3.
On the other hand, my girls listen when i say something, they know that I LOVE THEM GREATLY but, i am still their mama, and they listen and respect and know that i don’t say things for the sake of saying and that i always mean the best for them.
With this i am saying, keep up the good work! maybe give more thought about not being too physical with Kiko. She learns by example and if you hit her for hitting someone else, you are sending a mixed and confusing message there.
Get to her level (squat or on your knees) so you can have eye contact with her, and just say with a strong voice that you mean business. “That is a big no, no! we don’t hit. we are gentle” -and rub her little arm gently to show her what gentle is, and repeat “gentle, like this” while stroking her arm-. It will take a little while but she will catch.
Chie says
Really appreciated your comments and sharingnyournexperience. Andy and I were talking about it over breakfast today. I wonder if I could teach gentleness to Andy by the method you suggested? He will be very confused when I try it.
Kathya says
hahahaa…. It would be hilarious to watch you discipline your own grown husband. ^_^
but honest to word, it works.
My girls Faith(5) and Lulu(3) arent physical with others and i have been enforcing this method of “keep you hand to yourself” for over 4 years. Now Catalina(19 months) is another story. Her sister spoil her rotten. She is one tough cookie to discipline. *SIGH* but she, as well, will get there too. 🙂